new madcatz wii stick.

[m:)]

is IGN smoking something funny here, these sticks aren't actually sanwa are they?

stick review (http://gear.ign.com/articles/106/1063000p1.html)


Mad Catz has also beefed up the weight of the FightStick design, adding some extra weight to the device. According to Mad Catz, the internal components have been revised but still incorporate the genuine Sanwa components of the original design.


As a genuine Sanwa joystick, the control mechanism is a traditional 4-way mechanism, unlike western sticks which use an 8-way system. The 4-way design will appease fighting game purists, but will take a little getting used to for newcomers.

http://www.gamefreax.de/wp-content/uploads/tatsunoko0723.jpg

[nightmareci]

The buttons sturdy and responsive, but the joystick is a little stiffer than the FightStick's big-ticket sibling, the Tournament Edition FightStick.
This can be interpreted in a few different ways, but one interpretation is that the stick isn't a real Sanwa, it's some rough imitation. Another is that the stick is something by Sanwa other than what's in the FSTEs.

The only Sanwa I've ever used is in my HRAP3, so I don't know if different Sanwa joystick models have distinctive stiffnesses; I also don't have any experience to claim if sticks of the same model (like those in HRAP3s) have varying stiffness.

My HRAP3 still has its non-Sanwa buttons it came with, so I leave interpreting if the buttons are Sanwa to others.

[Kitaru]

Ugh, they called square gate 4-way. :sowsuser:

Sanwa isn't listed as a selling point, -- just that the parts are "Japanese-style" -- so the parts should still be proprietary.

The only Sanwa I've ever used is in my HRAP3, so I don't know if different Sanwa joystick models have distinctive stiffnesses...
JLW is a bit stiffer than JLF, but you wouldn't see one in a stick like this. My understanding is that JLW and OBSN are intended for mounting on wood panels while JLF and OBSF are intended to snap into metal panels and the like.

[Red_Star]

Ugh, they called square gate 4-way. :sowsuser:

Ohh, that is what they meant. For some reason I was thinking of a diamond shape, which would make no sense.

I am wondering if this will be any good. I have the hori stick for the wii, but it isn't that good. I would be interested in it, since I do plan on getting TvC, although I doubt I will get that into it.

[Edo]

I'm pretty sure the stick and buttons aren't Sanwa.

Here's another review with lots of pictures: http://www.destructoid.com/blogs/nilcam/tvc-stick-review-160167.phtml

MarkMan, the MC employee who works heavily on their arcade sticks, requested that I try out the stock parts before upgrading to the Sanwa stick and buttons I have. I decided to give his team a chance before modding.

[nightmareci]

That Destructoid fan review is much better than the IGN one. Makes the stick sound like it's worth getting even if you don't plan on upgrading it, even with its non-Sanwa parts. Of course, being a Wii dongle peripheral (like the nunchuk and classic controller), it's not the best unmodded stick to use with a PC...

[Zaphod77]

Seems clear that, like most products based off the Hori Fighting Stick, that these are sanwa-styled parts. This means sanwa button clones, and a microswitch joystick with a square gate that is similar in design to the sanwa.

Sort of like how an Z-Arcade has a HAPP-clone stick and buttons, and cherry-clone miscroswitches.

[m:)]

I have the hori stick for the wii, but it isn't that good.

my hori fighting stick wii rocks!
it's in a thread someplace around here.. but anyways you can sanwa that stick up cheaper then this thing is.(seeing as you have the hori already)

That Destructoid fan review is much better than the IGN one. Makes the stick sound like it's worth getting even if you don't plan on upgrading it, even with its non-Sanwa parts. Of course, being a Wii dongle peripheral (like the nunchuk and classic controller), it's not the best unmodded stick to use with a PC...


my hori stick connects right up to my mac via blue tooth connected to the wiimote and works as a joystick (no key mapping)..


http://i61.photobucket.com/albums/h67/aktech23/photo.jpg

[iphys]

I'm kind of interested in this stick, especially since the D-pad on the Wiimote is so awful. I don't really like the analog sticks either, so it's also cool that you can use this in place of those, which I don't think the Hori stick let you.

I'm not too sure what the difference is between 4-way and square gate, but does it mean you can't register diagonals at all? I hate when I accidentally register diagonals on the D-pad or can't move perfectly straight horizontally or vertically with the analog sticks, but there are games where I would actually want to register diagonals.

[m:)]

the hori stick also works as a classic controller, but the stick is only the d-pad. it looks like the mad catz stick is easier to mod as, from what i've read, you do not need to alter the case at all. i was unaware the mad catz stick would work as an analog stick as well?

as for 4 way vs 8 way, both will still read diagonals. the difference being a square vs a diamond, with the diamond you force the stick in a left/right/up/down direction due to the shape of the restrictor (4 way) with 8 way the corners are in the diagonal directions making them easier to hit. I never use my hori stick with my wii, but with tatsunoko vs capcom this week I think I'll start.

[iphys]

It has a switch to select whether the stick corresponds to the D-pad, left analog stick, or right analog stick. I hate the position of the analog sticks on the Classic Controller, so this stick sounds like it would be awesome.

Is it likely that you would accidentally register diagonals by mistake and hard drop a piece when you're trying to tap this stick to the side? That drives me crazy with the D-pad when I'm playing Tetris Friends. Fortunately, Tetris Party doesn't allow you to register a hard drop if you are holding sideways (guess they realized the Wii D-pads are awful), but it does allow you to register sideways motions when you are soft dropping, and even that annoys me a lot.

[m:)]

iphys, if you get this stick drop another $25 USD on a sanwa JLF! It's supposed to be easy to replace. I never accidentally drop with my sanwa, but it's got a proper 4 way.
with tetris party the buttons are all on the bottom row however, and not logically placed. i considered rewireing but didn't want to deal with it breaking any other games.. like TvC which comes out tomorrow!

They have a drop in replacement for the stick here (http://www.lizardlick.com/pages/joysticks.shtml)

[m:)]

ign fixed their review, there is no mention of sanwa except in the user comments:

linked (http://gear.ign.com/articles/106/1063000p1.html)

[Zaphod77]

a square gate can be set for 4 way (diamond) or 8 way (square)

With 8 way mode, dragon punches are particularly easy.

All these sticks that come with square gates default them to 8 way mode. SOme can be switched to 4 way.

[Red_Star]

a square gate can be set for 4 way (diamond) or 8 way (square)

Can a diamond read diagonals? I know square can, but I don't think I have any experience with a diamond. I thought I heard somewhere that crane games use something like a diamond, so they only go left or right, and up and down, but nothing else. I could have imagined that though.

Also I have seen your stick before m: ). I remember it from a previous thread. My stick isn't quite that nice as yours m: ), but it isn't bad for what they cost.

If anyone gets the TvC stick please post about it. I like to hear what TC members have to say about sticks.

[Zaphod77]

with some sticks, it's barely possible to hit the diagonals,k even if the square gate is set rotated 45 degrees. with other sticks, it's completely impossible.

TGM games are designed with 4 way in mind, but programmed to try and remain playable on an 8-way.

[Kitaru]

Someone linked me to this comparison (http://www.shoryuken.com/showthread.php?t=211098&p=8290419&viewfull=1#post8290419) between the new MadCatz TvC SE parts and Sanwa JLF/OBSF. MadCatz apparently went to great lengths to clone Sanwa parts. It appears the main functional difference between either one is the length of the springs -- MadCatz springs are one coil longer than Sanwa. Apparently you can replace the joystick spring with one from a JLF and have a very good stand-in for "the real deal." Did I mention they have the 4-way/8-way switchable gate?

[m:)]

i saw that to, but you still have to wonder about the overall quality of the cloned switches... will they last? madcatz reputation tends to stay on the low side of the quality spectrum.

[Kitaru]

Perhaps. The switches would be easy to replace, though. You could buy individual switches if you needed to replace them at some point down the road, or go for a full stick/button replacement if you so desired.

[iphys]

Wow, all those photos are crazy.

I haven't had any luck finding a place in Canada to order this online, but supposedly EBgames carries it, so I'm going to try to see if I can pick one up next week.

[m:)]

gamestop/eb gmaes has them in stock around me. does the online store system show you where you can find them near you? gamestop sells them online as well..

on a side note, I 8-wayed my stick for the first time to play some tatsunoko vs capcom.. it's fun.. i think i need to grab a spare restrictor plate because switching back and forth is a pain.. I'm thinking i could make a door on the bottom of the stick to switch 'em out. I might be playing a little less tetris for a bit..

[iphys]

Yay, amazon.ca finally listed it, and they have it for C$80 vs C$90 at EBgames, so I just placed an order.

[m:)]

nice, iphys is breaking over to the dark side. moving the restrictor from 8 way to 4 way will be just like on the HRAPs.

[iphys]

So if you rotate the square gate to a diamond it goes from being 8-way to 4-way because you can't really hit the diagonals any more? Do you have to take it all apart to do that?

[KevinDDR]

It's very easy to do. I posted a link to it in the HRAP3 thread.

On JLFs (and presumably these sticks as well) you can still barely hit diagonals with the restrictor in the 4-way setting. However, this is fine. The goal is mainly to prevent accidental diagonals, which the JLF restrictor still does a fine job of. It's not like hitting diagonals will destroy your game or anything, it's mainly just to prevent accidental drop/move simultaneous inputs.

[m:)]

yeah, open the bottom of the case, pop off the bottom restrictor place and the center piece can rotate 90 degrees in it's track... it's easy to do.

[iphys]

Cool, thanks!

[iphys]

It came today, and I just spent the past 5 hours playing with it. The stick feels pretty good, but I'm surprised they say the buttons are stiffer than Sanwa, because I can barely even feel when I push them, and I keep accidentally triggering them with the weight of my finger if I get lazy about holding my fingers over the buttons.

The stick is great for being able to shift left/right while constantly holding down in Stage Racer, but for playing standard Tetris I'm still hitting diagonals by mistake, so maybe I'll try rotating the gate. The coolest thing is playing Bit.Trip: Void with it instead of the CC analog stick -- it generally seems easier only having to think of 8 directions instead of 360 degrees, and it rarely seems limiting.

[m:)]

i hate the button layout for tetris party.

I use the buttons that are blue on the stick, thumb for hold and pointer for left, middle for right and index for alternate left. I never really have an issue with diagonals on tetris friends but I have it 4 wayed.

do you have wiiji yet?

[iphys]

The layout for T Party seems perfect for me, because when I play with keyboard I'm used to using j, k, and ";" for ccw, cw, and hold, and the R button for holding is to the right of the ccw and cw buttons on the stick.

I 4-wayed it last night, and it works perfectly for never engaging the diagonals. I could slide along the gate from sideways to up in T Party, and it would hard drop, whereas that fails with 8-way. It's good for Groovin' Blocks too, because I have a problem with accidentally hitting diagonals in that game and misdropping. Interestingly, I also almost managed to make it through all 3 levels of Bit.Trip Void with 4-way too, lol.

I've been using wiiji for a while, but I haven't configured the CC controls to use it with the stick yet.